Here’s the skinny on the Monday, November 10, Town Council Meeting
New elected Councilors Gerald MacPherson Sr. and David E. Webster sign the oath of office after being sworn in by Town Clerk Barbara Bennett.
Agenda:
Organizational
1. Elect Chairman- Jean Demetracopoulos was unanimously re-elected as Town Council Chair.
2. Adopt meeting rules-The Council unanimously voted to adopt meeting rules of Roberts Rules of Order and the Town Administrative Code.
3. Sign policy on Treasurer’s Disbursement Warrants for Employee Wages & Benefits-Passed unanimously.
4. Elect Chair and Treasurer of the Vaughan Fund-The Council voted in Gerald MacPherson Sr. as chair and David Burke as Treasurer of the Vaughan Fund.
Recess
6:45pm Public Hearing – Solid Waste Ordinance
The Council heard public comment on the proposed amendments to the solid waste ordinance. The amendments make changes to the the solid waste ordinance to reflect the new Pay as You Throw (PAYT) program. Changes spell out requirements for private contractors that are providing trash pickup within South Berwick, including new fees for using the transfer station. New rules will require private contractors to take all commercial and industrial waste to the MERC facility. The new rules also set forth the requirements for use of the official PAYT bags. The new rules also set forth penalties for failure to follow the ordinance, creating roadside litter, and creating a health hazard due to accumulation of waste in an unauthorized location.
Public comment was largely negative with questions asked about the potential negative effects on waste haulers, the cost for the bags and its affect of this expense on families, and how the new ordinance would effect small businesses and home occupations. The Council indicated that they would discuss the ordinance’s potential affect on waste haulers that only serve South Berwick and consider clarifying the language as it relates to small businesses and home occupations. The Council presented their rationale for the PAYT program as a way to create a user fee based system that would encourage people to recycle and that would result in a cut to the tax rate (this year the PAYT program resulted in a .17 cent reduction in the mil rate) through lower tipping fees at MERC and through increased revenues from the sale of recyclable commodities. They indicated that the estimates they made were conservative and based on other Towns’ experiences with PAYT. Once the PAYT has a track record they will be able to predict its financial impact for the 2009/2010 tax rate and town budget. The Town Manager said that the town report will clearly explain the costs and revenues of the PAYT and transfer station so citizens can understand the finanical impact of the program. No Council action was taken on the ordinance.
During the Manager’s Comments there was discussion about whether to winterize and close down the St. Michael’s church building for the winter rather than heat it. $17,000 had been budgeted for winter heating. Councilors expressed concern about what damage might occur if it is not heated but there was generally consensus that it should not be heated. The Council is waiting for the feasibility study to determine what would need to be done to make the building suitable for a library.
New Business
1. Take action on Safety Enhancement Grant for Public Works.-The Council unanimously accepted a $2000 grant to assist with the purchase of traffic safety signs that are required by state law.
2. Take action on donation to Fire Dept.-The Council unanimously accepted $1000 that will go toward the turnout gear for one firefighter. The donation is from a bequest from the estate of P. Monroe.
3. Take action on donation to the Police Dept.-The Council unanimously accepted $1000 that will go toward a new radio and a ballistic vest. The donation is from a bequest from the estate of P. Monroe.
4. Take action on donation to the library.-The Council unanimously accepted $500 that will go toward the new library. The donation is from a bequest from the estate of P. Monroe.
5. Take action appointment to SB Feasibility Study.-The Council unanimously voted to have Councilor Burke serve on a Southern Maine Regional Planning Commission Feasability Study group to look for solutions to relieve downtown traffic congestion.
Hello all,
Long time viewer, finally registered to share my 2 cents. First of all I want to thank the webmaster for creating and hosting this great site. I appreciate all the local news and although I may not agree with some, the steady discussions on here are a shining example of what makes this country great!
The reason I chose now to finally register and share my opinion is regarding the new proposed waste ordinance. I will be the first to admit that this opinion should have been aired in person by me at this weeks meeting. Shame on me for not attending.
I actually received some information initially regarding the new ordinance when I called for a quote from a local vendor who offers curb side pick up of trash in town. I was simply inquiring if his rates would be cheaper for my family then the PAYT system. (I still planned on doing all of my own recycling, I just wanted to limit my trips to the chaos we call a transfer station and possibly save some money). The contractor told me his rate is currently $200 a year. At just under $17.00 a month, this seemed to be a break even point (for my family, comparing to the PAYT) and the luxury of not having to contend with the traffic and hassle of the transfer station was a no brainer.
Then he shared with me the kicker! He stated that the ordinance has very strict rules regarding private contractor trash pick up in South Berwick. First of all, even if I use the contractor, I MUST still purchase and use the PAYT bags! The ordinance also mandates curb side pick up must be mandatory recycling with the same guidelines as the transfer station (this part is not an issue with me). Then he said that the ordinance mandates the only location the contractor has to take his truck to empty it. (MERC in Biddeford) Then after he pays a annual license fee to the town to do business here, he has to pay an aditional fee above and beyond what MERC charges for total tonnage.
This part is my opinion: The new ordinance was written to put the private mom and pop trash haulers out of business! If I was that contractor, I would be hiring an attorney to find out if the language in the ordinance is legal! (I know that is probably cost prohibitive) How can the town dictate such specifics as to how a private contractor can run his business? (telling him he can only dump his truck at MERC, why cant he take his haul to any licensed facility?) If I choose to hire this contractor to pick up my trash, why should the town double dip and make me pay for the bags and then make the contractor pay AGAIN to dump it (not even at the town transfer station)? This entire ordinance is now out of control. Is it now set in stone? Do we the taxpayers have any other chance to chime in on the language or stop it altogether? Enough is enough!
Here is just a bit of the actual language from the ordinance which can be found on the link above …
“F. Private Contractors must obtain a license to use the transfer station. Licenses may
be revoked by the Town Council, following notice and hearing for violation of this
article. Licenses shall be renewed annually on or before January 1. A one time
application fee of $250 shall accompany the private contractor’s initial application.
Renewal licenses shall cost $100 in addition to a $50 per truck fee.
G. All commercial and industrial businesses must contract with a Private Contractor
to transport their waste to the MERC facility. No commercial or industrial waste will be
permitted to be disposed of in the hopper at the Transfer Station.
H. All Private Contractors must be properly licensed by the Town of South Berwick
pursuant to §115-3.F of the Town of South Berwick’s Flow Ordinance in order to
collect MSW within the boundaries of South Berwick. Private Contractors are
responsible for the waste they collect and must dispose of it properly at the MERC
facility as designated in § 115-13. Regulation of wastes. Private Contractors will be
billed by the Town of South Berwick for the tonnage they deliver to MERC according to
the following fee schedule. Tonnage delivered to MERC shall be billed to the private
contractor on a monthly basis, at the Town’s contracted rate plus $2.00/ton. A nominal
administration fee shall be added to the invoice each month, not to exceed ($25.00).
All invoices sent to the private contractor must be paid in full within thirty (30) days of
the date of invoice. Failure to pay the Town will result in a revocation of the company’s
ability to dispose of MSW under the Town’s contract with MERC and shall result in the
Town initiating collection proceedings. The Private Contractor shall be responsible for
all collection costs.”
I could not find language in the ordinance that states I would have to use the PAYT bags when I hire a private contractor. Maybe it is this part, “Private Contractors are
responsible for the waste they collect and must dispose of it properly at the MERC
facility as designated in § 115-13. Regulation of wastes.”
The vendor / contractor I spoke to said that he attended the meeting and that is the case. (maybe they are adding that?)
I realize my rant here has been rather long, but as my screen name will tell you, I am fed up in South Berwick.
We have used Waste management for curbside for several years. It goes to the landill in Rochester. It’s easy, reasonable in cost, and less than PAYT bags would be for us.
Waste management does not use the Sobo transfer station. The packer that stops by our house drives directly to Rochester. It’s independent.
So the question would be will waste management have to follow the new rules? I am sure waste management has the money to get a few good lawyers if they think it would be worth there while to challange the new rules. This is normal, the town doesn’t want loopholes or they will loose money on this bag idea and have to charge more per bag and risk loosing more people and revenue. If you thought this was about recycling you can see it is just about money.
This is why a lot of us there had problems with this ordinance. Local private haulers will no longer be able to use the transfer station. All of our trash will have to go to MERC. This includes dumpsters from Cumby Farms and local businesses to dumpsters at condos and apartments. I wonder if Waste Mgnt. is going to take the trash from these dumpsters to MERC instead of Rochester and without stopping for anyone elses for the price they’re getting now? This is only about the money. The facts presented about increasing recycling, while true for some, are presented to sweeten the deal. It’s a case of – How can we make a tax increase look beneficial. The way it’s written now, local haulers will be put out of business, we’ll be forced to buy the bags with no other option, extra costs for removing trash will be passed on to local businesses which will be passed on to us. This will make it harder for local businesses to be competative, as well as put an additional burden on the citizen who’s already getting screwed from having to buy the bags in the first place. This is not rocket science and it doesn’t have to be this hard.
Eric
Waste Management doesn’t have to follow any rules. They don’t use the transfer station. They go to teh landfill in Rochester. They by-pass the South Berwick system entirely.
great comments.
Taxpayer: Waste Management may be doing business as usual today, but with the new ordinance starting they will have to follow the new guidelines or face penalties (in the ordinance).
Again, how can the town get away with this?
Is this a done deal or do we get another say at a public forum?
Even if we get a chance to state more opinions, does the council have final say to go forward with what they want anyway(ordinance as written currently)?
Clarification: I am not opposed to the PAYT system as a concept. I am opposed to the current ordinance as written. My rant is specific to the part on private contractors. I should be able to choose how I want to run my household and not be told this is your only option. Option A should be PAYT and bring your trash to the transfer station following the new guidelines. Option B should be hire a contractor and pay them the going rate to haul your trash. Simple.
The council needs to be more open to ideas and listen for a change. Move forward with the PAYT but only when it is ready to run smoothly and written appropriately. This town does not need more legal fees which are sure to be coming when waste management reaches in to their deep pockets to challenge this.
They can’t get away with it. Private enterprise is not forclosed on by the ordinance. If the waste goes somewhere else (not MERC or the transfer station), there’s no legal control that can be exercized.
I think the nugget here is that there is at least one private hauler who does use the SoBer transfer station. The residents who use this private hauler should most definitely be required to use PAYT bags since they’d be required to use them even if they hauled their garbage themselves. But I agree that residents who use private haulers that do not use the SoBer transfer station should not be required to use the PAYT bags.
Also, I read in the Foster’s today (11/14) that some transfer station employees are helping unload private hauler trucks. We do not pay the employees to do this, they should cease. Yes it’s a nice gesture, and may speed up the process of unloading trucks in our small and crowded facility, but the transfer station workers need to be available to the rest of us for assistance.
The Town can regulate those who uses the town’s Transfer Station, and those that use MERC bringing waste from S. Berwick; presumably because of the town’s contract with MERC. It can’t impose regulations on waste that is managed outside that system, and at other facilities, such as through Waste Management.
taxpayer and others:
I must admit I have difficulty in understanding the language in the ordinance. When you read it, is it your understanding that the town is saying that all waste generated in South Berwick MUST be sent to the MERC? That is how I am reading it.
It doesn’t work that way. If waste goes to other facilities that have no contractual relationship with the Town; that’s “free trade”. Otherwise it’s called “flow control”, and it’ not legal.
I just read the proposed ordinance, including ARTICAL
II – Flow control, originally adopted in 1987. These provisions were in place to support the Town’s commitment to MERC. Subsequently, these types of “Flow Control” provisions were found unconstitutional by the US Supreme Court. I’m quite sure they remain illegal.
In any event, even without amendment, the existing ARTICAL II is not applied in Town. Waste Management, and maybe others, have been servicing my home for many years, taling the material to the landfill in Rochester, NH.
The logic is: if the waste is not being managed by the Town, through Town contracts, the Town has no involvement, financial or otherwise. It’s as though the waste does not exist from the Town’s perspective.
I am free to contract with a service, as an individual with free market opportunities, that does not use Town facilities or contracts. If I am not free to do that, someone at the Town had better have a very good legal basis to tell me I have to pay more money to use a system I chopose not to use. Mr. Vaniotis?
Taxpayer- thanks for the input. As far as being able to contract a service as an individual with free market opportunities …
Is this not similar to say myself hiring a lawn service for a Fall clean up and them hauling away brush and debris? The town does not regulate the location this service takes said debris. Or how about if I hire someone to do a remodel on my home? Are they told what to do with the stripped siding from my house? The answer is obviously NO. What makes the town think they can delegate the way this particular contract service operates if they do not utilize town services? Unless someone corrects me on the interpetation here, I will stop my rambling. Thanks for the input and listening.
Precisely. Years ago, communities tried to implement “flow control” of waste when they signed waste disposal contracts with energy facilities. The ordinance in question goes back to 1987, when the town got involved with an earlier MERC contract. Waste companies nation-wide challenged this trend, and “flow control” got heard at the US Supreme Court , and over-ruled. Since then, “flow control” has no teeth. It can be used to regulate how waste is managed through specific facilities or contracts, but if waste is managed outside of those facilities/contracts, it’s a free market.
Once again, it appears that the Town Council has skimped on getting competent legal council. Most of this ordinance as it is written is legallly indefensible. Sigh. Any good lawyer could shred this in a heartbeat.
The Town can not tell a ptivate business how to do its business.
Plus towns people wanting to opt out and use a service can engage in one very simple act of civil obediance. Tie the garbage bags with a nice ribbon. Put a bow on them……..and put the “gifts” at the bottom of the driveway for your “friends” from wasteemanat.
This thing gets loonier and loonier……at the end of the day this is not going to make us all a dime….nope, its going to cost a lot s monyh. Motrobt, reading the ordinance, its easy to see that this is going to end up costing us more…..
this is not a good solution fThe Town. The onle group going to benefit — the only one — is the gang printing up the bags.
Anyone know if that contract was open to bids? Or did they just select the most expensive provider and then move on…..
Rather than getting angry, just ask the person in charge – it’s quicker, easier, and more accurate…
“If your trash does not come to the Transfer Station you do not have to use the blue bags. You are already paying for your disposal costs through your commercial hauler.”
EM- Great point and I will. I was already planning on attending Monday night if I can free up something.
Everyone- I hope that you read the line in one of my posts that read, “Clarification: I am not opposed to the PAYT system as a concept. I am opposed to the current ordinance as written. My rant is specific to the part on private contractors. I should be able to choose how I want to run my household and not be told this is your only option. ”
I did go off on what I assume was / is the council’s short sightedness in the language of the ordinance. I should do that in person and not here. As stated above, I will stop my rant on here about that. I think I expressed my frustration (beat it to death) enough. And to clear things up and hopefully not ‘hijack’ this board too much more .. I like this board and plan on continuing to exprss my opinion on it. I do not want to initiate any uncivil discussion (not saying there has been here, I can just see the tone). We all have our own opinion and I appreciate being able to share it here.
Molly, thank you for hosting this. After following this board since what I think is the beginning, I do have a little feedback (idea). Could you create a ‘bulletin board’ style section so people can start threads on random topics for discussion? It could be an erea to discuss any range of topics in town (not just the hot political item of the day). This may also entice new registration. People could discuss just about anything going on in town (youth sports, their garden club, looking for a contractor (who is your guy?)section, school section, looking for help section, barter / trade area etc.) Just an idea and thanks again for running this.
You better bet this letter is sent anonymously, because I expect to get pounded for it. I would like to advance the radical idea that pay-per-bag or pay-as-you-throw is GOOD and we should all get behind it in South Berwick.
A few months ago, I had never heard of the PAYT concept, but when I did it got me thinking about how I throw out the trash. Yes, I used the recycle areas at the transfer station. But I was careless about it. If something seemed too much trouble to separate out, I tossed it in the mixed garbage. By far the biggest category of garbage in our household went into the dumpster.
So when PAYT got floated I began to think: What if this came out of my pocket? And what if I knew I could reduce my bill by taking the time to recycle more? And not just recycle more, but even think as a consumer about trying to avoid wasteful packaging, and waste in general? Because it all comes out of our pocket. Whether we pay for bags or pay as taxpayers or pay as a wasteful society, we are paying every day. We’re paying no matter what; so why not get a system that encourages us and our neighbors to waste less?
That’s when I became a supporter of PAYT. Maybe some of the wrinkles of South Berwick’s proposed plan need to be amended, but in general this a win-win for the taxpayers who now are being bled by lazy neighbors who won’t sort their trash.
Yet from reading the blog you would think the town council is supporting highway robbery with PAYT. I don’t get you people out there who write to this blog week after week against this plan that will save us money while improving the planet. Sure, I know there is always the skin-flint anti-tax point of view, who will give a knee-jerk opposition because the tax benefits are less obvious than the fact that individuals have to pay for bags, etc.
BUT WHERE ARE THE GREEN ADVOCATES on this issue? Why are you so quiet about PAYT? I read all these articles on this blog about energy efficiency and “Greening Up,” caulking and insulating a window or two – why aren’t you out there voicing support for this big, community-wide effort that will positively impact the carbon footprint of the entire town. Hello?
I don’t like payt because it is not about recycling. It is about making more money to spend on other things. If the bags don’t make the town enough money then they will go up in price. It is all wrong. The best way to help the enviroment is to recycle all plastics and do single stream making it easier for people to recycle and more people will. If we are going to do this payt (pay for what you use in a pro rated way)idea I want it for everything in town. I don’t use the town hall much so everybody going in there should have to pay a fee, I don’t use the school system, everybody that does should pay the full cost per child not just there property taxes. I mean they use it not me. People will say thats crazy talk but we already pay taxes to use town facilitys and to pay a tax on top of being taxed to use the dump is outragous. Put the 17 cents per thousand back on my yearly tax bill and let us cut programs to adjust that tax rate. We are not solving the problem just shifting it.
But that’s just it — it IS about recycling. You only pay for what you don’t recycle. If somehow you manage to recycle everything, you would use the transfer station absolutely free! I don’t think this point has been made clear enough.
Right now there is a tax on us for lazy people who don’t recycle. With PAYT we would be liberated.
Peter, you write about “the town” as though it’s an entity separate from “us.” But our tax dollars run the town. If these dollars are not being drained at the transfer station, that is good for our wallets.
but if they don’t make 60,000 dollars form the bags then they will need to find the money somewhere else. So it does not matter how much you recycle the town still needs to make 60,000 dollars from the trash bags. They want the bags to sell so they can make that money. If they don’t get it then bag prices go up or taxes go up one way or the other
Yes, the town council has already stated that they would indeed raise the price of the bags if the program doesn’t raise the desired amount of money. I don’t like PAYT at all. Our family already recycles everything we can, and we have done that for years. We compost, watch the packaging we buy, etc. Sorry, I WANT, it is about hidden taxes – I can’t recycle anymore than I already do so I won’t be saving any money. I’ll be spending more…..
I’m already a rabid recycler and I don’t mind the idea of PAYT. I agree that it constitutes a hidden tax, but I don’t mind paying that. What I strongly object to is paying for this service AND having to wait in long lines! This past Sunday at 10:30 was especially bad, There was a line of cars stopped on either side of the road…at least 50 vehicles waiting for their turn. The limited Sunday hours causes a road hazzard, wastes fuel, creates a mess inside the station and wastes everyones time. If we’re expected to pay more to throw out our trash- at least we should get good service for our money!
I can’t be at the Council Meeting this week. I wish that someone would ask the council to study the number of users per hour for all of the days the dump is open and make the schedule based on usage.
I agree with the approach recommended by Brian Dowd to adjust the hours the transfer station is open to be consistent with peak usage. The recent changes to reduce the Sunday and Friday hours at the transfer station have resulted in much more congestion, both at the station and along the road, during those few hours the station is open. As a retiree, I have the luxury of using the transfer station on Wednesdays but I have a great deal of empathy for those who only have weekends, or Friday evenings, for this chore. It’s especially tough, even hazardous, during spring and fall yard cleanup. I DO recycle & compost so PAYT will be o.k. for me, but would prefer single stream recycling, as recommended by the Solid Waste Committee.
Here’s a radical thought… Next time you buy something small at Wal-Mart or Staples or Target, or wherever, and it has packaging, like say a small electronic device or computer software, open it up in the parking lot and throw the packaging away at the store. Then you don’t have to worry about tossing it in your PAYT bag or recycling it at home. Problem solved. As a matter of fact, if enough people did this, I’m willing to bet that stores like Wal-Mart/Target would get on the case of the various manufacturers to have them reduce the amount of packaging used. Remember the CD “Long Box” that they used to use to package music CDs? “Long Gone.” Because the consumers and retailers spoke up. We can sit and yammer all day about reducing waste, but waste reduction starts with reducing the packaging on things we buy.
If our town council weren’t developing a PAYT program, the prospects for long lines and taxes being driven higher by the solid waste problem would be even worse. I say, “Bring on PAYT!” It is to the town council’s credit that they are showing leadership in spite of all the guff they get from the public on this issue. We need to quit throwing cheap shots, think ahead, and reduce, recycle, reuse in South Berwick.
Single stream has been said could save the town 100,000 a year. Now that is how you save money and recycle more. With no longer needing to seperate the trash in dumpsters all over the transfer station that would also help long lines and stream line people in and out of the transfer station. If the council wants to get my respect they would follow there commitee’s recomendations. Leadership is not finding ways to tax people for a problem in revenue, and try to sell it as a “new way to make people recycle”. I believe if they said hey we need more money and we are going to make it by charging you for throwing away your trash, I would call that leadership (poor leadership ,also a good way to be voted out next time).
Peter — Do you have the information that backs up the cost savings for single stream? I have not seen any numbers that account for the start up costs for single stream. I remember hearing at one of the workshops that to go to single stream might require the purchase of a new compacter. Also my understanding is that we would still need to separate waste from recyclables and that if the wrong materials are put into the recycling waste it can mean that the town can stand to lose money for the recyclable commodities. I have read the single stream vendor’s website and it sounds wonderful but then when I did a google search to see how it’s actually working in other towns the reviews are mixed. I think that single stream sounds like a good idea but my understanding is that it is not a sure cost saving method and the sorting is not as simple as it sounds. I would like to see cost/benefit comparisons of single stream vs. PAYT and some discussions regarding the potential pitfalls/advantages of each.
It is not about recycling, it’s about raising $$ to fill in the hole dug by the previous counsel on the town manager fiasco. I recycle everything I can and still have some trash to throw out. To think that you can recycle everything so you can user the transfer station for free is unrealistic. Yes, peole can do a better job recycling. I would be happy to volunteer as a “recycle cop” to make sure things are properly disposed of and would encourage for other concerned citizens to do the same. The staff does what they can, but I was appalled at the lack of public regard for signs and lables at the transfer station. Also what do people think of the “No Picking” ordinance? A few weeks ago my children and I were reprimanded by the staff for taking a some small wooden chess pieces out of the wood container. No we weren’t climbing in it or otherwise endangering ourselves. I questioned this and was told it due to liability issues. If you try hard enough, you can attribute everything to liability issues. If my child, under my (adult) supervision took the pieces, I see this as a small amount less to dispose of. Isn’t this the same concept as the swap shop. While I understand there are liability/injury issues, there’s an obvious lack of thought in how to minimize the amount of items we must pay to dispose of. While the answers that will suit the majority are difficult to come by, some common sense may go a long way.
how long can i keep diapers around this summer while i wait to fill a bag???
As long as you can stand it.
Molly I was told by a commitee member that they told the council for a 32,000 dollar investment they could save around 100,000 dollar a year with single stream. All you needed was a machine to handle taking all the recycles in. You would still need to get the trash to Merc. That bad contract can’t be changed for a while. I think that the problem with all of this is information. I was told by the commitee memeber that the transfer station head did not like the new ideas. I think this is all very difficult. We need to be able to see on the town wedsite what the cost of the transfer station are now broke down in detail and what it would be with the change over. It is suppose to be out there and needs to be told to everybody. If this was done then I bet people would swallow this payt idea better knowing that it was vented properly.
From what I know, single stream would:
1) Be Cheaper (but that would mean fewer people on the payroll)
2) Simplify the traffic patterns significantly, making them more sane and safe
3) Encourage greater recycling rates , which would make PAYT more palatable
But the Town Manager is the person who should be evaluating these issues with a level head, drawing on whatever resources necessary to review with the council what the real options are. But that is delayed…………
This entire thing is completely ridiculous…..
1) Single stream is more efficient, but we can’t have it because egos are involved.
2) No one cares about recycling, this is a revenue stream to support an untenabe transfer station — the transfer station should be reorganized due to safety concerns aone, but again, no, egos are involved.
3) We’re doing this to raise how much? 60K? Well, put the town insurance policies out for OPEN bids. Do a real search and get a more realistic insurance situation. Dump the church, its eating us alive. And for godsakes, start consulting real lawyers when conducting town business. (What did we lose in botched negotiations last year due to inept or absent legal advice? A lot.)
There’s your 60K and more. We have to stop running this town based on placating friends and soothing egos. The town should be run like a business, not a coffee clutch where we try to make sure that no one goes away with hurt feeilngs.
Frankly, the transfer station is a neon lit example of this…..it is an accident waiting to happen. Yet, the layout can’t be changed, cause, I’ve been told, the individual who laid it out would get upset.
I think the council should consider how upset we’re all going to be when some kid gets clipped running across the lot and the parents file a multi-million dollar lawsuit. And….we won’t be able to say we didn’t know.
it discourages recycling. Come January drive around South Berwick and count the number of residential dumpsters you see. You can count plenty already. Nice dark blue bags that poeple paid for…you don’t think people will feel they have the right to throw whatever they want in the bag??? Think again. Paint, used oil, whatever they want. You think the people that rent the dumpsters are recycling?? Nor would I.
True, bss, maybe come January we may see more residential dumpsters and commercial trash collectors. But maybe not so many. It ought to dawn on people — as it dawned on me — that instead of paying the bill for a dumpster or private carrier, they can dump recyclables for FREE at the transfer station. That is the point of PAYT. Under PAYT, our old practices of not recycling, of sneaking in that expensive paint and other contaminants, etc. becomes an expensive luxury.
Some people here have argued for single-stream. I am not well versed in that. If it’s economically feasible I wouldn’t oppose it. But it sounds to me that with PAYT consumers separate their own trash, whereas with single-stream we pay people to do it. If that’s so, it has to follow that PAYT is more economical.
All the howling against PAYT sounds like people who feel like it’s their god-given right not to separate trash, because we grew up that way. But it’s like our other fond illusions like cheap gas or cigarettes not causing cancer. When the facts go the other way, you have to change.
Where are all you green advocates on this issue???? Speak up, tree huggers! This is for trees and wallets, both! Let’s come together on this.
All I know about single stream is that it seems that nobody wants to hear it. The solid waste comittee has researched it, but the council decided to plow ahead with the PAYT program, thus giving the impression it was being used as form of revenue, with little to do with recycling. Why don’t we know more about single stream?? We appointed a comittee to study it, they have the research, why aren’t they being heard?? You’re a green advocate.. don’t you want to know more??? Why aren’t you demanding that your councilors speak up on this????
I’ll tell you what dawned on me on Sunday, my only day off, as I sat in a traffic snarl at the dump.. You actually want me to pay to come here?? That is what dawned on me!
bss, you say “you don’t think people will feel they have the right to throw whatever they want in the bag??? Think again. Paint, used oil, whatever they want.” Sometimes I feel like there are two South Berwicks. The people I know in town are pretty environmentally aware and civic minded and I don’t believe they would feel like they could throw toxic materials away with their trash. This country, with money raised through taxes, has already paid billions and billions of dollars to clean up toxic waste dumps and to mitigate the toxic effects of old fashioned dumps. I would hope we’ve all learned our lesson and know that if we dump with impunity we end up paying for it with dollars and our health. Call me a treehugger but I think it is criminal and antisocial to disregard laws about toxic waste.
It seems like we are mixing two different issues here. One is whether people will and should recycle and dispose of waste properly. The other issue is how South Berwick will pay for the cost of dealing with solid waste and how the Town is choosing to approach the matter. It seems counterproductive to mix the two issues. I think most people do care about the environment and are concerned with making sure their children have a clean healthy planet. I think it’s fine for people to disagree with and question the PAYT policy but it’s just plain wrong to use anger with a Town policy as justification to trash the environment.
I am not trashing the environment, but to think that it’s not going to happen is just naive. I recycle everything I possibly can as it is, and did so long before it became politically correct. I also know that not everyone thinks the same way. I am sorry but I don’t want to to even think of what will be in the dark blue bags. Sorry.
I just hope that people put the same amount of righteous anger towards people who disregard littering and toxic waste laws as they have towards the Town Council and the transfer station.
PAYT and Single Stream are separate isues, that should be evaluated separately. Either can be implemented with or without the other.
Sometimes they are combined: ie if a community goes PAYT, they make recyling much more convenient and efficient (which single stream does……data shows that municipal recycling rates increase significantly when good single stream programs are put in place). The recycling rates go up because:
- More items are recyclable. No need to have angst about what the separated program takes of not. All plastic, paper of all types, glass, etc is included in single stream.
- The user can have a much simpler home set-up, and much simpler trip to the transfer station. You go to two hoppers, and you’re done. Much quicker. You don’t wander around the facility with 5-6 different places to deposit (running into many people doing the same thing)
- The resulting convenience draws everyone in to recycling; even those eco-terrorists that tend to cheat if full separation is necessary.
- There are established single steam facilities that can be used right now, and more being developed.
The trouble is, people need to change their mindset, both users and public works employees. And some of the savings involve fewer people working at the facility doing all that extra work.
having watched this town in action for two years now, i can tell you all…
1) we will implement PAYT. it will not make money but rather lose money and add to the chaos at the transfer station. nevertheless, we will carry on with this for at least two years before there are any changes.
2)Single stream which costs less and might earn us more will be disappearing into the misty regions of time.
3) Trash will start appearing along the roadsides, etc., and we will end up spending more money to clean up the town, but whatever.
This town does what ever is the most complex, the most expensive and the most ridiculous thing it can do.
Environmental concerns, Molly, are not really what is going on here. The town wants/needs another revenue stream….they don’t want to economize in the areas that are screaming for cost cuts, so….bingo, here’s a boon doggle they can ride for a few years…….
the sad thing is, they aren’t even being smart about this.
ah, and at the risk of offending those who don’t like their feelings hurt…here’s a question…
who got the contract for the plastic bags????????????????????????? was it open to bidding??????????????????????????????
Thank you, Taxpayer, for explaining things I didn’t know about single stream. I should change my name to I WANT PAYT OR SOMETHING THAT MEETS THE SAME GOALS OR RECYCLING AND COST-EFFECTIVENESS, MAYBE SINGLE STREAM
Anonymous who has “watched this town in action for two years now” sounds very cynical and negative. I’ve watched SB for over two decades on a wide range of issues, and I know things don’t move in a straight line. There is no need to get bitter or angry. Councilors and staff rotate. They have different experiences, different memories, different conversations with citizens, learn lessons and move on.
If our current town leadership (staff and elected officials) has concluded we should give the blue plastic bags a shot and tries PAYT, what is the problem? Why all the emotion? They will just need to demonstrate its success, just as success needs to be demonstrated in all town programs. We should all fully expect that if PAYT has flaws and should be tweaked — and perhaps single stream can be added, as suggested by Taxpayer — that the town should do so. And if it’s a complete flop, the town and a better proposal is out there, the should walk away from PAYT.
But there are strong arguments for providing citizens an incentive to not drop so much stuff in the hopper, as I used to do. That is the aim of PAYT. So I am just gratified the town is looking to save money and to encourage citizens to recycle. PAYT sounds like a step forward until proven otherwise.
I’ve noticed on this blog a generalized anger from some people that gets aimed like scatter-shot at anyone with responsibilities and duties to do the public’s business (Councillors, staff etc). There is always an underlying cynicism and expressions of gloom and doom. I guess people like the anonymity, and their ability to spout off.
Others give more reasoned, thoughtful, and constructive input. I tend to ignore the cynics, and read with interest the more constructive posts.
because i disagree, point out certain rationalities, and would like the town to conduct business in a more professional and intelligent manner, that’s no reason to marginalize what I say.
the thing is, given the way this town is run, more people are often hurt than helped by their actions. And there seems to be little or no concern about that.
I may disagree with certain language in the ordinance, but PAYT is absolutely going to drive an increase in the amount we recycle VS. the amount we throw in the hopper. My opinion is to give it a try and see how it goes. Once you see it up and running and you see something that is bothering you, GO to the meetings and say it in public. I already recycle, but not enough. I am currently trying to set up space at my house to sort the items and figure out how to minimize the amount of PAYT bags I will be using. I actually have started looking in to purchasing a trash compactor. Pretty big investment up front, but in the long run, who knows?